Cosatu is turning up the heat with threats of strike action despite its unwavering support for the ANC in the run-up to the elections. Mandy Rossouw asks Cosatu general secretary Zwelinzima Vavi if this is payback time
Cosatu is threatening public strikes every chance it gets. Are these real threats or just grandstanding to show the independence of the trade union federation from President Jacob Zuma?
We have no reason to demonstrate independence. We are raising serious matters of concern to doctors and drawing government and the public’s attention to the issue. These are not some lazy threats, we are serious.
Are Cosatu’s demands based on a payback for the federation’s efforts in helping the ANC win elections?
We are reminding the ANC of the undertakings it made during the elections to the education sector, healthcare sector, the police, etc. It is the ANC which has recognised the problems — that these people are underpaid and overworked and leaving the public service. This impacts on the delivery of services to the public. We continue to support the ANC but at the same time put pressure on the ANC.
Zuma said in his state of the nation address that four million jobs will be created by the expanded public works programme (EPWP). Why are you in favour of the fact that the government’s chief job creator in the next few years will be EPWP, which does not create “decent” jobs?
We have always been in favour of the EPWP, [even] knowing its limitations. We know it is not permanent, but it can cushion people from the worst effects of poverty. It gives people confidence, better skills and references to go look for another job. It makes a huge difference and it doesn’t resolve the issue of poverty, but it does help resolve the problem of underdevelopment. At the end of it you will have fenced the whole of the Transkei, you would’ve built roads in places where there are none. But we know it is not a permanent solution. Obviously if you ask us to choose between EPWP jobs and jobs in the manufacturing industry, which are permanent and give people access to pension funds and medical care, we’ll jump at the manufacturing ones.
What is the ideal relationship between government and labour in the Zuma era?
We are enjoying the longest spell of unity and cohesion and we are very happy with that. But we will continue to be robust and boost left-wing policies. There is an agenda — we will defend the ANC from those who oppose transformation. We want to avoid two extremes — to take our support too far and in the process be uncritical, but on the other hand we don’t want to display independence too far so that it looks like we are in bed with those who are in principle in opposition to the ANC. We want to continue to antagonise the middle ground and avoid the extremes.
Why do you think ANC secretary general Gwede Mantashe is saying the trade union’s strike threats will weaken the Zuma government?
He is overly sensitive and feeling that criticism is a show of disloyalty. He is saying government is doing all these things that are raised and that we should work together with them. He said we must intensify boardroom engagements — and we agree with that, there is no contradiction. But we have to respond to our members, who are restless, otherwise we lose credibility.
We do engage with our members and tell them that government is working, but government must know there is huge pressure to deal with the issue of the doctors.
I must say the media overexaggerated the point that Gwede made. There is no new crisis in the alliance, afterwards we laughed about it. Some people are very sensitive and think that it should be our automatic stance which says never criticise the government because you are opening it up to its enemies.
They don’t understand they can love but be critical. You can’t say we spent so much money and time on the election campaign, now we shouldn’t be critical.’
They say we should drive quietly to the Union Building and discuss our issues there. But society doesn’t work like that — if the left is too mute there is a problem. There must be consistent public noise. The best we can do is consistently bring up issues like inflation targeting, the budget deficit, and say that there are alternatives. But that voice must be strong and must be debated by society as a whole.
Which unions have a real plan to strike and how many members will be affected by this?
In the public service currently there are no strike notices because a formal dispute has not been declared. It is the occupation-specific dispensation, which is an old agreement, that is driving the emotions up high. There is big pressure, but we’re still engaging and giving government a chance. They seem very willing to engage and hopefully we will find a solution when we meet next week.